When Anger is Actually Healthy

00;00;00;00 - 00;00;20;26

Greg Miller

For a lot of people, their strategy is containment. So they try to contain, contain, contain. And then there's a tipping point and then they just explode in their anger. And one of the principles that we teach is if you're having an intense reaction, there's typically a historic component. Yeah. It's that if you're having a $100 reaction to a $10 issue, you got to figure out the other $90.

00;00;20;29 - 00;00;43;11

Greg Miller

And anger is a great example where a lot of people have this intense anger that's showing up in their present circumstance. But the reality is, is very much what you're talking about. Its historic anger that they've never really addressed. And so it all gets connected together and comes up in this current moment. And so the person that we're with now is the one that's getting all of this energy.

00;00;43;14 - 00;01;01;17

Greg Miller

But the reality is all of the energy is not about that person or what they've done or what they said, or even the current circumstance. So that curiosity piece I think is so important of so what is this about really? What am I angry about? Why is this triggering me? And how much of this is about the present?

00;01;01;17 - 00;01;03;00

Greg Miller

And how much of this is about.

00;01;03;00 - 00;01;22;02

Greg Miller

The past that I never really acknowledge?

00;01;22;04 - 00;01;49;11

Randy Evert

Welcome to the People of Cheer podcast. I may be Every year co-host and Steve, we've got a special podcast for you featuring Greg and Beth Miller from our staff here at 842. Greg and Beth are going to be telling you about Clean Anger, and this podcast will be very beneficial to a lot of people out there. So we hope you'll enjoy this, this broadcast.

00;01;49;13 - 00;01;54;12

Randy Evert

Here now is Beth and Greg Miller and the Faithful and True podcast.

00;01;54;17 - 00;02;21;00

Greg Miller

Well, welcome to the Faithful and True podcast. I'm Greg Miller and I'm the host. And with me today is Beth Miller, my wife and my guest. And we've been a part of the Faithful and true team for 17 years. And we both work as pastoral counselors. And today what we're going to be talking about is clean anger. And probably the best thing that we can do is just start with a conversation about anger itself, because there's a lot of messaging about that.

00;02;21;00 - 00;02;33;23

Greg Miller

There's a lot of misunderstanding, and also there's a lot of hurt for people when anger has been misused or destructive in their family. So let's just start with anger itself. What would you want people to know?

00;02;33;26 - 00;03;03;11

Beth Miller

Well, I think first, one of the things I'm aware of is that this topic comes up a lot in women's groups, at the Women's Workshop and appointments that I'm meeting with women one on one, but I imagine it's true for men. Absolutely as well. And like you said, anger gets really bad press and for some understandable reasons. Also true is that it is a God given emotion.

00;03;03;14 - 00;03;31;06

Beth Miller

Paul even tells us, you know, be angry and don't sin in your anger. So I think the call for us is to get in there and figure out the nuance of what does it look like to honor this emotion that God designed us to have, while also not creating a lot of havoc in either the expression of it or the denial of it?

00;03;31;08 - 00;03;57;00

Greg Miller

Well, you know, I, I either heard a speaker or I read it in a commentary, but it was about that passage of be angry and just don't sin. And what the commentator went on to say is actually, at times, it's a sin not to be angry that when we are confronted with unrighteousness, when we are confronted with destruction and we remain silent and we don't have a reaction to it, that in itself is a sin.

00;03;57;03 - 00;04;23;17

Greg Miller

Yeah. And so Paul is really extending an invitation to be angry. And in also providing that caveat, how we show up in our anger is important. So it's not carte blanche. It's not just free range. It's not we show up in any way in our anger. But there are some parameters. I don't know if you remember this, but when the boys were young, we provided some guidelines around anger and we said, you know, you can be angry, but there's three rules.

00;04;23;22 - 00;04;30;03

Greg Miller

The first one is you cannot hurt yourself. The second one is you cannot hurt anyone else until.

00;04;30;04 - 00;04;30;26

Beth Miller

You your brother.

00;04;31;01 - 00;04;49;08

Greg Miller

That's typically what met your brother. And then the third one is you can't hurt property, which basically means you couldn't throw your toys. But we wanted the boys to fill a freedom to be angry because we knew there were things that they got to be angry about. So if they wanted to go stomp their feet, they could do that because that didn't break the rules.

00;04;49;10 - 00;05;07;27

Greg Miller

If they were to go run around the backyard to offload some of the energy, that would be acceptable. So there are parameters in which there are safe ways to express our anger. One of the things that you and I have talked about in getting ready for this podcast is that I'm anger is one of those emotions that produces energy.

00;05;08;00 - 00;05;33;18

Greg Miller

You know, I think there are two categories their emotions that reduce energy and then emotions that produce energy because the emotion is connected to adrenaline. And so eagerness, excitement, anxiety, fear, anger are all connected to that rush of adrenaline. And it's part of our survival strategy. We do get energy when we are anger because that provides us an opportunity if we steward that energy well to create safety.

00;05;33;25 - 00;05;50;14

Greg Miller

So maybe the first thing when someone is angry, it's recognizing that the energy that it is producing is expected. It's part of who God designed us to be, and it is about how we're going to steward that anger or steward that energy. What are we going to do with the energy? Yeah.

00;05;50;16 - 00;05;53;14

Beth Miller

I, you know, I love my quotes.

00;05;53;15 - 00;05;55;03

Greg Miller

I do you love your quotes?

00;05;55;04 - 00;06;28;09

Beth Miller

I do. And so Harriet Lerner says this anger exists for a reason and always deserves our respect and attention. And I love that because there it it's just to what you're speaking about that it's so important we're paying attention to what is this energy this is creating in me. Right. And to take it a step further, that it deserves our respect and attention because it is a messenger, right?

00;06;28;10 - 00;07;10;22

Beth Miller

It is such an important messenger. I've heard, our colleague Rebecca Dekkers say that anger is in defense of something good. And I really appreciate that now because most of us, you know, didn't have a lot of guidance around this. Instead of inviting curiosity towards the anger, usually what I know I was encouraged to do not even so much by my parents, but more just in the church culture, right, was to, tamp it down.

00;07;10;24 - 00;07;44;09

Beth Miller

Right? The sooner you were through it, the better. And so then what happens? And I think this is an important part of what we're needing to name today is what unhealthy anger, what unclean, dirty anger looks like. And so instead of paying attention to that good energy and the way it can lead us into important action, it then rather leaks out as contempt or bitterness or resentment, right?

00;07;44;11 - 00;07;44;24

Beth Miller

00;07;44;25 - 00;08;08;03

Greg Miller

Well, and it can also explode, you know, for a lot of people, their strategy is containment. So they try to contain, contain, contain. And then there's a tipping point and then they just explode in their anger. And one of the principles that we teach is if you're having an intense reaction, there's typically a historic component. Yeah. It's that if you're having a $100 reaction to a $10 issue, you got to figure out the other $90.

00;08;08;05 - 00;08;30;16

Greg Miller

And anger is a great example where a lot of people have this intense anger that's showing up in their present circumstance. But the reality is, is very much what you're talking about. It's historic anger that they've never really addressed. And so it all gets connected together and comes up in this current moment. And so the person that we're with now is the one that's getting all of this energy.

00;08;30;22 - 00;08;48;21

Greg Miller

But the reality is all of the energy is not about that person or what they've done or what they said or even the current circumstance. So that curiosity piece I think is so important of so what is this about really? What am I angry about? Why is this triggering me? And how much of this is about the present?

00;08;48;21 - 00;08;52;05

Greg Miller

And how much of this is about the past that I never really acknowledged?

00;08;52;10 - 00;09;01;28

Beth Miller

Yeah, I think without the curiosity we just default into what we've always done with anger. You know.

00;09;01;29 - 00;09;20;24

Greg Miller

Or what was modeled for us. Yeah. You know what? What's true is in for most of the men who come through our workshop, when they talk about anger, it was either modeled through destructive anger. It was big explosions. It was, words that were, you know, hurtful. It was accusations and blame.

00;09;21;00 - 00;09;22;23

Beth Miller

Or the silent treatment.

00;09;22;24 - 00;09;40;25

Greg Miller

Or the other end of the pendulum where they someone was angry and you could sense that they were angry, you could just feel that energy off of them, but they were trying to contain it or ignore it or deny it until it was still leaking out. And so for those of you that grew up in an environment where anger was not modeled well, it makes perfect sense.

00;09;40;25 - 00;09;59;01

Greg Miller

One of the things you're trying to do is learn. What does it look like to have clean anger when the model for me has been so destructive? And I would say coming from my own family system, anger wasn't something that we were, it wasn't we were weren't allowed to express. It was simply that it wasn't expressed.

00;09;59;03 - 00;10;21;09

Greg Miller

My parents didn't model it. I didn't know anything about it. And so I brought that energy into our relationship where you just ignore and deny anger. And when one of the things that's interesting about our relationship is there's been for years where you've identified, communicated, expressed, that you could see anger in me, you know, and I would deny it.

00;10;21;10 - 00;10;41;05

Greg Miller

No, I'm not angry. But the good news in recovery is I have access to that anger. Now, I don't always express it in a healthy way. I can still ignore it, or it sometimes comes out in intensity. Yeah. What's true, though, is I have access to it in a way that I never did historically.

00;10;41;07 - 00;11;11;13

Beth Miller

I, I think that's such a good point, because one of the things that I've heard over the years is that we can either a person can either more quickly go to anger and avoid getting to the sadness that's underneath, or go to more sadness and avoid getting to anger sometimes. And that's a generalization. But I do think that, one of those might feel safer, if you will, to another.

00;11;11;20 - 00;11;11;29

Beth Miller

00;11;12;04 - 00;11;35;08

Greg Miller

And I've said this on a podcast before, but, you know, one of my experiences and what I've seen in other people is I think there's kind of three primary emotions, you know, there's anger, there's sadness, there's fear. And in recovery, there's one of them that we begin with. It's the one that we have most access to. Even the person who says, I don't really have any feelings or emotions, they'll discover one.

00;11;35;08 - 00;11;59;24

Greg Miller

And it could be that, you know, it's anger, it could be that it's sadness. But beyond that are the others. And so I know in my own story, sadness was the first thing I had access to. And then I eventually got to the anger and eventually I got to the fear. But I, I see pretty typically that there is a kind of an order in that order for everyone is different depending on their own histories and their story.

00;11;59;26 - 00;12;18;02

Greg Miller

Some people start with fear, and that's the thing that they have the most access to. Yeah, I want to go back to that leaking thing that you said earlier, because I think that that's important for a lot of people. They have not been expressing their emotion, they've been leaking their emotion. And you use example of resentment and bitterness.

00;12;18;02 - 00;12;42;12

Greg Miller

And I think that's exactly unprocessed anger. In fact, I talk about bitterness as a combination of grief and anger. If I'm bitter about something, typically it's because there's something I've lost. There's a grief in there that I've not acknowledged. But I'm also angry about something. And the grief and the anger have gotten combined. And I'm not really processing or feeling or acknowledging them independently.

00;12;42;16 - 00;12;50;05

Greg Miller

And so even acknowledging some of the emotions that we do feel, is there an energy of anger that's kind of hidden in those?

00;12;50;06 - 00;13;23;22

Beth Miller

Yeah, I think before we get to some naming of some ways that clean anger can show up, an additional thing I want to say about unclean anger, is that it's important to notice when we're teasing or we're being sarcastic. Right? How many times, you know, does someone express their anger in the form of a joke or teasing someone?

00;13;23;24 - 00;13;33;23

Beth Miller

The other person feels hurt or surprised or, you know, shut down by that? And then the one who made the comment says, can't you take a joke? Right, right.

00;13;33;24 - 00;13;57;16

Greg Miller

Well, and sarcasm especially, I think, is anger and humor mixed together. And the thing about it is when we try to blend anger with something else, the anger can get lost. So it's not fully expressed. So like sarcasm, it's anger and humor. And so we're really not expressing our anger. But what's also true is we're really not being funny because the anger is bringing an edge to it.

00;13;57;16 - 00;14;04;26

Greg Miller

It's bringing a sharpness to it. And I like what you said is sometimes we kind of play it off. Why can't you take a joke or. I'm just.

00;14;04;27 - 00;14;06;01

Beth Miller

I'm just kidding.

00;14;06;04 - 00;14;31;25

Greg Miller

But the reality is, if we're paying attention, there is anger there that needs to be acknowledged. And if we can start with the belief that my anger is valid, if I'm willing to get in there and figure out what is this really about, what am I angry about? My anger is valid, and typically it's trying to tell me about a hurt and injury, a need, and if I get curious about it and discover that, then the anger can move me towards healing.

00;14;31;29 - 00;14;33;20

Greg Miller

Yeah.

00;14;33;23 - 00;15;19;09

Beth Miller

So I think one final thought about the way that unhealthy anger shows up can possibly be in the form of depression. And by no means do I want to oversimplify depression, because that can be caused for so many different reasons genetic, chemical situation, all kinds of things. And I think one of the contributing factors to depression can be at times, if there is unspoken anger, unprocessed anger, that a person doesn't feel like they have the capacity or the resources to offload.

00;15;19;11 - 00;15;55;23

Beth Miller

And some of this, one of the reasons that I think, sometimes we sit on our anger and hold it is because somehow we've believed that was the good person thing to do, or the good Christian thing to do. And I, I think it's really important that we're we're acknowledging, again, this is a God given emotion. We've just got to be wise and how we find our way to express it so that other people aren't hurt.

00;15;55;25 - 00;16;00;28

Beth Miller

Right. And neither are we in the holding of it. Yeah, right.

00;16;00;29 - 00;16;33;00

Greg Miller

Well, and even this really illuminates the importance of faith community. What may be true is you're in a marriage where anger hasn't been safe. Maybe your spouse has been hurtful and destructive. Maybe, you're you're afraid of your spouse because of the way that you've experienced anger, and so you're stuffing your own anger. And so we need these safe spaces where we can bring our anger and it can be heard and validated and affirmed, and also we can release some of the energy that we're carrying.

00;16;33;03 - 00;16;59;09

Greg Miller

Especially in the early days of recovery, there may be things that a husband is angry about and doesn't feel appropriately, that they can share that with their spouse because of the betrayal, but their community can be a place where they can express their anger. And for the spouse who doesn't feel like it's safe in their relationship because of the way that anger has been weaponized, they need to say community of women that they can express their anger to.

00;16;59;12 - 00;17;20;06

Greg Miller

And because a whole idea is there must be safety. One of the things I teach at the workshop is I can have my emotions and be safe, and I can have my emotions and others can be safe. And anger is a great example. Safety is the litmus test, I believe that begins with this idea of clean anger. Am I safe when I'm expressing it?

00;17;20;06 - 00;17;54;19

Greg Miller

And are others safe? Yeah. So if we go back to those three principles we talk to our children about. The first one is I cannot hurt myself in my anger. So if I had destructive patterns, if there's, patterns of injuring myself through self harm or even I the way that I approach food or the way I approach exercise, if I'm harming myself in my anger, that's not healthy, you know, clean anger if I'm harming other people or hurting other people, if I'm hitting, if I'm slapping, if I'm name calling, yeah, that's not going to be safe.

00;17;54;19 - 00;18;12;19

Greg Miller

And if I'm hurting property, the example I use it, the men's workshop. If I get angry and I punch the wall, I broke two rules because I hurt my hand when I hit the wall, but then I broke the wall and hurt the wall. So there are ways to be safe and to be angry. And that safety piece comes first.

00;18;12;21 - 00;18;42;08

Beth Miller

Yeah. I, I think there are some things that I have found really helpful over the years to name as kind of very practical ways to live out what you're naming. One of those is that if I want to express my anger cleanly, I'm going to own it. So I'm saying things like, I own that I am angry rather than, you've made me angry.

00;18;42;10 - 00;19;00;24

Beth Miller

And some of that I understand is the way that maybe society even talks about it. He made me so angry. She made me so angry. And one of the first rules here of clean anger guidelines is that we're owning it. I am angry.

00;19;00;25 - 00;19;01;28

Greg Miller

It is my anger.

00;19;01;29 - 00;19;02;28

Beth Miller

Yeah.

00;19;03;01 - 00;19;20;05

Greg Miller

Well, and I also say, you know, I use the example of shame. Nobody can shame me. They can only trigger the shame that is in me. And this is the same way. Now, someone else may do something that triggers the anger in me, but it is my anger and that's why I get to be curious about it. What is this anger about?

00;19;20;05 - 00;19;48;24

Greg Miller

What am I really angry about? And like most things, there's a complexity to it. So there may be the triggering circumstance. But what I got curious about is what is it that's getting triggered in me that's resulting in this anger? And a lot of times, you know, kind of an unhelpful conversation is when I spend the entire conversation talking about what the other person did that triggered my anger versus really talking about what that anger is about for me.

00;19;48;29 - 00;19;57;21

Greg Miller

And what is it, what it is in me that's triggering the or what it is about the anger that's getting triggered in this particular situation.

00;19;57;23 - 00;20;26;27

Beth Miller

I think another important guideline is that we're kind, and that might sound impossible to be kind in our anger. I mean, it may sound really incongruent, and yet I think that it again follows some of those guidelines. You know, we aren't being punitive or we aren't name calling. We're not being demeaning. We're just, owning. I feel really angry about this.

00;20;27;02 - 00;20;56;28

Greg Miller

But what's interesting is it is kind to name the anger. Yeah. It is uncommon to hide the anger because we have this belief that I can keep this to myself. Nobody will ever know. But what's true is it leaks. It leaks in our comments. It can leak in our distance. You know, if I'm angry at someone and I've not really addressed it, then I consciously or unconsciously make decisions to distance myself from that person, to create safety, or to keep the anger from getting triggered.

00;20;56;28 - 00;21;22;25

Greg Miller

And again, we want to acknowledge the complexity of this. If you grew up in an environment or if your current circumstances anger has been unsafe, anger has been dangerous. I'm anger has been weaponized. It makes perfect sense that talking about kind anger, it seems like we're talking about a completely different language. So we're back to this idea that if historically, anger has not been safe in your relationship.

00;21;22;27 - 00;21;47;04

Greg Miller

The first thing you're going to do is create safety, which may mean you have to create physical distance from the other person. So if you are in a relationship where there is something, whether it's physical harm or emotional harm that's coming from anger, you create safety in any form that you can. And if that means physical distance, separation, moving out, then you do that because you are worth the safety.

00;21;47;05 - 00;22;07;10

Greg Miller

You are worth being in an environment where you're not constantly in fear of injury. So we just want to acknowledge we are talking about kind anger. And for some of our listeners, that may seem like a million miles away. And what is also true is there are ways that we can express our anger, and it is kindness in order to do that.

00;22;07;11 - 00;22;08;12

Greg Miller

00;22;08;15 - 00;22;37;03

Beth Miller

I think I'm really glad you said that. I think another important part of this process is that we have to be responsible and in this process of expressing clean anger, and some of that responsibility may be taking care of ourselves. If we're in a relationship with someone who cannot find their way to kind anger. If, like you said, it's very destructive, it's enraged.

00;22;37;05 - 00;23;20;09

Beth Miller

Any of those things, it's it's toxic. We we have to own that responsibility to put that distance between ourselves and that kind of rage. Right. If we are finding the, the possibility that we can move towards, learning a new language in a relationship to express clean anger, I think one of the other ways that responsibility shows up with this is that I'm taking responsibility to own all the layers of the thing that I'm angry about.

00;23;20;11 - 00;23;45;22

Beth Miller

So one of the stories that I tell in my book is about a woman whose husband had been in recovery for 3 or 4 years, he was doing good work, and she there was a part of her that could acknowledge that. And there was a part of her that really struggled with her anger at him. And to be fair, he had done a lot to create some real anger in her.

00;23;45;27 - 00;24;12;17

Beth Miller

And also, she knew she was stuck. So she came to group one day and said, would you guys ask me some questions about this, which I thought was so brave for us, right? So someone asked her, how old is this anger? And she just closed her eyes and sat there for a little bit. And then someone else said,

00;24;12;20 - 00;24;48;08

Beth Miller

Is there anyone else in your life who's ever betrayed you? Well, she began to cry and name that. Years ago, her parents had divorced and her dad remarried his affair partner and quickly embraced her family. And my group member was in junior high at the time and was a cheerleader at her local school, and her dad showed up to support his then stepsons game, who was also playing.

00;24;48;13 - 00;25;31;23

Beth Miller

Right. And, it was so fascinating, she said. He basically waved, but that was it. And she said, I realized now, looking back, you know, as she began to talk that morning, how much of a betrayal that was, right, that he had not just left her mom, but in many ways left her too. Well, as she continued to work with that in the weeks and months to come, what she in very courageously owned was she was holding her husband responsible for all of her anger.

00;25;31;25 - 00;26;00;07

Beth Miller

Right? She was putting it basically in his bucket, if you will, and saying all of that is yours to own. And as she began to do more work with it, she could tease out like, yes, this is these are some things I'm angry at my husband for. And over here, these are things that predated him, right? They had nothing to do with him, and she began to do some work that she felt towards her dad.

00;26;00;09 - 00;26;24;10

Greg Miller

Yeah. You know, it's interesting, that idea of ownership. If I'm going to own my anger, then what that means is I'm not going to blame anyone else for my anger. And I know of a situation where a person regularly is angry and tense in their anger, takes it out on their spouse, and typically will say something like, well, I that was just the way that I was raised and dismissing it.

00;26;24;13 - 00;26;44;07

Greg Miller

And so, yeah, maybe you were raised in an angry home and everybody got to be angry, and there was tons of yelling and screaming. And we can all choose differently now. And so what's interesting is ownership means I'm not going to blame anyone else. My circumstances, what my partner did, but I'm also not going to to go into my shame.

00;26;44;14 - 00;27;03;16

Greg Miller

If I do get angry. I'm not a horrible person. I'm not evil, I'm not a monster, and I need to figure out how to do my anger differently. But when we're trying to own something, when we are either in blame or shame, it guarantees that we're not able to fully own it. And if I don't own it, then I can't change it.

00;27;03;18 - 00;27;41;21

Beth Miller

One of the things that I think we've alluded to, but haven't said real directly, is that another principle of clean anger is that first, we offload some of that chaotic energy and we named it. The energy isn't all bad, right? It can activate us. It can lead us to taking some healthy steps eventually. And it's really important that as wise adults, if we're really into an activated, revved place with our anger, it's my responsibility as a wise adult to offload that.

00;27;41;23 - 00;28;13;28

Beth Miller

So I am, you know, finding ways to hit a pillow or, you know, run until I can't run anymore. I don't really run, but, you know, other things, right? Scream, sing, whatever, whatever it is. One of the things that I've often one of the stories I've often told is about throwing plates, and that was so meaningful to me, to I was having trouble accessing my anger.

00;28;13;28 - 00;28;43;14

Beth Miller

And my dear friend and mentor, Cheryl, was a silent witness to me in that I really call it a spiritual practice. And I wrote, I got an old box of dishes from the thrift store, and she would hand me a plate and I would write just a word or so with a Sharpie on a plate. What I was angry about, it only was important for me that I knew that, and then I would throw it at this brick wall.

00;28;43;16 - 00;28;57;14

Beth Miller

And, there are sacred practices like that. I know of other people who have thrown eggs or taken a hoe to weeds in a garden. Done some kickboxing.

00;28;57;16 - 00;29;15;02

Greg Miller

Right. Well, one of the things I encourage them in to do when it comes to anger is connect it to physical activity. Yeah. And so if you run, you run your anger. If you lift, you lift your anger, if you do Pilates, you Pilates, your anger. But the idea is when I'm doing it, I'm actually connecting it to what I'm angry about.

00;29;15;05 - 00;29;38;16

Greg Miller

So if I'm running, every time I make a step, I declare what I'm angry about. It's the version of writing it on the plate. You know, if I'm lifting every time I. I lift that weight, I declare what I'm angry about. Because if I can connect the anger and the energy and offload the energy, then that allows me to come back with a proportional response when I'm ready to address it and address the circumstance.

00;29;38;18 - 00;29;42;10

Beth Miller

Yeah, it takes the steam out of it and.

00;29;42;14 - 00;30;04;14

Greg Miller

Well, it's kind of like what you would talk about when you were going to your group. You could go to that group of women and offload whatever needed to be offloaded, so that when you came back home to me, I didn't get all of it. Yeah. And maybe I deserved all of it. But the reality is, in where we were, I didn't have the capacity to receive all of it.

00;30;04;18 - 00;30;21;24

Greg Miller

And so it was a gift to me that you were willing to give it to those other women to hold and then bring back a proportional response to me. And what's also true is I wasn't responsible for all of, you know. You know, it's that thing I tell men, you have hurt your wife and you are not responsible for all of the hurt.

00;30;21;29 - 00;30;47;23

Greg Miller

And it's very much like what you said in that situation. Your your client was angry and her husband was not responsible for all of her anger. Now, there's some of it. Absolutely, absolutely. And yet not all of it. And the gift that we can give our spouse is offloading that that does not belong to them. And just bringing because a proportional response to, you know, to a circumstance is something a couple can navigate together.

00;30;47;24 - 00;31;04;19

Beth Miller

Well, I think one of the things that's important to name is that my safe community has not been hurt by me, right? By and large. Right. And so they can hold my anger, it gets a little more dicey.

00;31;04;22 - 00;31;22;01

Greg Miller

Not it's you're not directing it at them. Yeah. You're just including them in it. Yeah. And that's a very different thing. You're not you know, sending the anger towards them and weaponizing it. You're just sharing it. And it's kind of like a weight. You're all able to carry them together. Well in the few minutes we have left. Yes.

00;31;22;02 - 00;31;26;24

Greg Miller

Is there anything else that you would want the audience to know about clean anger that we've not said?

00;31;26;24 - 00;31;59;23

Beth Miller

Yeah, I think real quickly, if this feels so foreign, just like so far out of reach, then start with a third party in in the room. A therapist can help you navigate what needs to be said because again, there's so much history we all bring to this topic that it may be really necessary to learn a new skill in the safety of someone who can call timeouts, who can name when we're getting blame me or shame me.

00;31;59;25 - 00;32;02;10

Beth Miller

You know, I think that can be really helpful.

00;32;02;12 - 00;32;20;02

Greg Miller

One other thing I would say is, for the person who doesn't have access to their anger, it's helpful to ask the question, what might I be angry about? Yeah. So instead of trying to get in there and what am I angry about? Sometimes that feels too daunting, but let's just open up the possibility and be curious. What might I be angry about?

00;32;20;02 - 00;32;24;02

Greg Miller

And that might open the door just enough that someone can step through it?

00;32;24;03 - 00;32;46;12

Beth Miller

Yeah, I want to just close with this brief blessing. It's from the book The Cure for Sorrow by Jan Richardson, and she offers this prayer trust that the other face of anger is courage, that it holds the key to your secret strength. That the fire it offers will light your way.

00;32;46;15 - 00;32;56;07

Greg Miller

Beautiful. Great way to end well. Thanks for being here to talk about clean anger. And it is a part of our history and our story. And we are getting better at.

00;32;56;09 - 00;32;57;10

Beth Miller

We are getting cleaner.

00;32;57;11 - 00;33;18;15

Greg Miller

Great. And so for those of you that are new to faithful and true, we encourage you to check us out at Faithful and true.com. There's a series of podcasts that we have and you can check those out also. But our hope for you is whatever will bring healing, whatever brings possibility that you will move towards that, that you will hear that invitation to your next right step.

00;33;18;17 - 00;33;24;11

Greg Miller

Thank you for being with us.

00;33;24;13 - 00;34;04;21

Randy Evert

Thank you for joining us today on the Faithful and True podcast. You've been watching Greg and Beth Miller from the Faithful and True Staff as they talked about clean anger. We hope that this content and this podcast will be helpful to you as you as you face your struggles with sexual addiction and all of these issues. So in the meantime, we invite you to visit our website, Faithful and true.com, where you'll find lots of information and online registration for our three day intensive workshops at Faithful and True.

00;34;04;27 - 00;34;20;16

Randy Evert

And we hope you'll look into that, as these have been proven to be very beneficial to the couples that come to Faithful and True. In the meantime, we hope this coming week will be a week for you that's filled with many blessings and with great vision.